Legislature(1993 - 1994)

08/31/1993 09:00 AM House HES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
                                                                               
          HOUSE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL SERVICES                          
                       STANDING COMMITTEE                                      
                          WORK SESSION                                         
                         August 31, 1993                                       
                            9:00 a.m.                                          
                                                                               
  MEMBERS PRESENT                                                              
                                                                               
  Rep. Cynthia Toohey, Co-Chair                                                
  Rep. Pete Kott                                                               
  Rep. Bettye Davis                                                            
  Rep. Irene Nicholia (via teleconference)                                     
  Rep. Tom Brice      (via teleconference)                                     
                                                                               
  MEMBERS ABSENT                                                               
                                                                               
  Rep. Con Bunde, Co-Chairman                                                  
  Rep. Gary Davis, Vice-Chairman                                               
  Rep. Al Vezey                                                                
  Rep. Harley Olberg                                                           
                                                                               
  OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT                                                    
                                                                               
  Sen. Johnny Ellis                                                            
  Sen. Dave Donley                                                             
  Sen. Suzanne Little (via teleconference)                                     
  Rep. Joe Sitton     (via teleconference)                                     
  Rep. Jim Nordlund                                                            
                                                                               
  COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                           
                                                                               
  Work Session:  Proposed Regulations on State Lab Fees                        
                                                                               
  WITNESS REGISTER                                                             
                                                                               
  DR. PETER NAKAMURA, Director                                                 
  Division of Public Health                                                    
  Department of Health & Social Services                                       
  P.O. Box 110610                                                              
  Juneau, AK 99811-0610                                                        
  Phone:  (907) 465-3090                                                       
  Position Statement:  explained and defended fees                             
                                                                               
  DR. KATHERINE KELLEY, Chief                                                  
  Section of Laboratories                                                      
  Division of Public Health                                                    
  Department of Health & Social Services                                       
  3256 Hospital Drive                                                          
  Juneau, AK   99801                                                           
  Phone:  (907) 586-3586                                                       
  Position Statement:  presented detailed history of how                       
                       regulations were adopted, what sort of                  
                       comments were received, how fees work                   
                                                                               
  REP. JOE SITTON                                                              
  Alaska State Legislature                                                     
  Dimond Courthouse, Room 609                                                  
  Juneau, AK 99801                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 465-2327                                                       
  Position Statement:  questioned fees and their public health                 
                       impact                                                  
                                                                               
  CHARLES F. TEDFORD                                                           
  Radiological Physicist                                                       
  Division of Public Health                                                    
  Department of Health & Social Services                                       
  320 West Willoughby Street, Suite 101                                        
  Juneau, AK 99811                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 465-3019                                                       
  Position Statement:  explained tube fees, defended                           
                       inspection system                                       
                                                                               
  MARGARET ERICKSON                                                            
  Seward General Hospital                                                      
  P.O. Box 265                                                                 
  Seward, AK 99664                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 224-3845                                                       
  Position Statement:  expressed concern with tube fees,                       
                       advocated moving radiological                           
                       inspector's office to Anchorage                         
                                                                               
  TONI LEE, Lab Supervisor                                                     
  Family Medical Center                                                        
  HC 60, Box 3140                                                              
  Delta Junction, AK 99737                                                     
  Phone:  (907) 895-5100                                                       
  Position Statement:  expressed concern with lab fees, their                  
                       effect on patient participation in                      
                       public health process                                   
                                                                               
  SHELIA NORDALE                                                               
  Central Peninsula General Hospital                                           
  P.O. Box 866                                                                 
  Soldotna, AK 99669                                                           
  Phone:  (907) 262-4404                                                       
  Position Statement:  concerned about effect of fees on                       
                       hospital operations and collection of                   
                       public health data                                      
                                                                               
  JOAN BENNET SCHRADER                                                         
  Coalition of Labor Women                                                     
  Mount Redoubt Chapter                                                        
  P.O. Box 1587                                                                
  Kenai, AK 99611                                                              
  Position Statement:  opposed to fees, insistent on full                      
                       state funding                                           
                                                                               
  SEN. SUZANNE LITTLE                                                          
  Alaska State Legislature                                                     
  State Capitol, Room 7                                                        
  Juneau, AK 99801                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 465-2828                                                       
  Position Statement:  expressed concern over infrequent                       
                       radiological testing, uncertainty as to                 
                       need for fee increases                                  
                                                                               
  TERRY SCHMIDT, Lab Supervisor                                                
  State Health Laboratory                                                      
  Fairbanks, AK 99701                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 474-7017                                                       
  Position Statement:  representing self, questioned amounts                   
                       of lab fees                                             
                                                                               
  JENNIFER GARCIA                                                              
  P.O. Box 110518                                                              
  Anchorage, AK 99511                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 276-5222                                                       
  Position Statement:  expressed concern over fees and                         
                       privatization trend                                     
                                                                               
  HEATHER FLYNN                                                                
  Abused Women's Aid in Crisis, Inc.                                           
  100 West 13th Avenue                                                         
  Anchorage, AK 99501                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 279-9581                                                       
  Position Statement:  explained shelter's dependence on                       
                       Neighborhood Health Services and state                  
                       labs                                                    
                                                                               
  JEANNE WOLF                                                                  
  Municipality of Anchorage                                                    
  Department of Health & Human Services                                        
  Anchorage, AK                                                                
  Phone:  (907) 343-4605                                                       
  Position Statement:  expressed concern over effect of fees,                  
                       need for publicity of fee waivers                       
                                                                               
  JAN WELLS                                                                    
  Municipality of Anchorage                                                    
  Department of Health & Human Services                                        
  Anchorage, AK                                                                
  Phone:  (907) 343-4605                                                       
  Position Statement:  stated fear of cost shifting and effect                 
                       of fees on high quality of state labs                   
                                                                               
  WILLIAM GALLANGER                                                            
  664 West 34th Avenue, #425                                                   
  Anchorage, AK 99503                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 562-5276                                                       
  Position Statement:  representing self, concerned with fees                  
                       and priority for tests                                  
                                                                               
  SALLY GUINEY                                                                 
  Petersburg General Hospital                                                  
  P.O. Box 1244                                                                
  Petersburg, AK 99833                                                         
  Phone:  (907) 772-4291                                                       
  Position Statement:  mammography fee too high, inspections                   
                       ought to be combined                                    
                                                                               
  SUSAN KERNES, President                                                      
  Board of Directors                                                           
  Kachemak Bay Family Planning Clinic                                          
  P.O. Box 984                                                                 
  Homer, AK 99603                                                              
  Phone:  (907) 235-5194                                                       
  Position Statement:  opposed fees, recommended consolidation                 
                       into one state lab                                      
                                                                               
  KIM SMITH                                                                    
  Kachemak Bay Family Planning Clinic                                          
  P.O. Box 2742                                                                
  Homer, AK 99603                                                              
  Phone:  (907) 235-3436                                                       
  Position Statement:  listed specific public health concerns,                 
                       noted importance of accessibility                       
                                                                               
  DAN FIEBELKORN                                                               
  Southern Peninsula Hospital                                                  
  P.O. Box 4333                                                                
  Homer, AK 99603                                                              
  Phone:  (907) 235-8101                                                       
  Position Statement:  expressed concern that HIV tests would                  
                       no longer be confidential, and that                     
                       fees would hurt rural areas more                        
                                                                               
  MARY JEFFERSON                                                               
  Bartlett Memorial Hospital                                                   
  9351 Miner Drive                                                             
  Juneau, AK 99810                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 586-8417                                                       
  Position Statement:  specified some fees which shouldn't be                  
                       charged, likely problems with billing                   
                                                                               
  DONALD NOVOTNEY                                                              
  Bartlett Memorial Hospital                                                   
  1120 Timberline Court                                                        
  Juneau, AK 99810                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 586-8413                                                       
  Position Statement:  worried over charges for Hepatitis-B                    
                       tests, said use of private labs to save                 
                       money and time likely                                   
                                                                               
  TONY BELL                                                                    
  Municipality of Anchorage                                                    
  Department of Health & Human Services                                        
  Sexually-Transmitted Diseases Clinic                                         
  525 `L' Street, #107                                                         
  Anchorage, AK 99501                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 343-4611                                                       
  Position Statement:  concerned with fees' effect on                          
                       confidentiality, collection of data,                    
                       public use of labs                                      
                                                                               
  HAROLD JOHNSON, M.D.                                                         
  Anchorage Neighborhood Health Center                                         
  1217 East 10th Avenue                                                        
  Anchorage, AK 99501                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 257-4600                                                       
  Position Statement:  concerned with fees as compared to                      
                       private labs, inquired if doctors would                 
                       decide finally for whom to waive fees                   
                                                                               
  GEORGE M. HANSEN, D.D.S.                                                     
  Alaska Dental Society                                                        
  Anchorage, AK                                                                
  Phone:  (907) 567-7518                                                       
  Position Statement:  opposed increase on per-tube                            
                       inspection, questioned entire                           
                       inspection program                                      
                                                                               
  KAY LAHDEMPERE                                                               
  Municipality of Anchorage                                                    
  Department of Health & Human Services                                        
  525 `L' Street                                                               
  Anchorage, AK                                                                
  Phone:  (907) 343-4624                                                       
  Position Statement:  supported keeping tests in state labs,                  
                       keeping fees low to account for client                  
                       hardship                                                
                                                                               
  PATRICIA HONG                                                                
  Alaska Nurses Association                                                    
  237 East 3rd Avenue, #3                                                      
  Anchorage, AK 99501                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 274-0827                                                       
  Position Statement:  supported prevention, including                         
                       testing, over mere treatment of illness                 
                                                                               
  MELINDA EVANS, M.D., M.P.H.                                                  
  Center for Health & Counseling                                               
  University of Alaska Fairbanks                                               
  Health & Social Services Building                                            
  Fairbanks, Alaska 99775                                                      
  Phone:  (907) 474-7043                                                       
  Position Statement:  opposed fees, listed problems expected                  
                                                                               
                                                                               
  ELMER LINDSTROM                                                              
  Special Assistant to the Commissioner                                        
  Department of Health & Social Services                                       
  P.O. Box 110601                                                              
  Juneau, AK 99811-0601                                                        
  Phone:  (907) 465-3030                                                       
  Position Statement:  explained department's budgeting                        
                                                                               
  REP. JIM NORDLUND                                                            
  Alaska State Legislature                                                     
  Dimond Courthouse, Room 608                                                  
  Juneau, AK 99801                                                             
  Phone:  (907) 465-4968                                                       
  Position Statement:  criticized fees                                         
                                                                               
  SHARLANE DONALSON, Lab Supervisor                                            
  Crossroads Medical Center                                                    
  P.O. Box 5                                                                   
  Glennallen, AK 99588                                                         
  Phone:  (907) 822-3203                                                       
  Position Statement:  exposed flaw in fee schedule,                           
                       questioned revenue generating potential                 
                                                                               
  SUZANNE OLSON, Health Lab Supervisor                                         
  Center for Health & Counseling                                               
  University of Alaska Fairbanks                                               
  Health & Social Services Building                                            
  Fairbanks, AK 99775                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 474-7043                                                       
  Position Statement:  opposed fees, questioned how they were                  
                       calculated                                              
                                                                               
  DAN RITTER, Manager                                                          
  State Health Lab                                                             
  Fairbanks, Alaska 99775                                                      
  Phone:  (907) 474-7017                                                       
  Position Statement:  representing self, opposed fees                         
                                                                               
  VICKI MARIE COLACICCO, Director                                              
  Public Health Nursing                                                        
  Norton Sound Regional Hospital                                               
  P.O. Box 966                                                                 
  Nome, AK 99762                                                               
  Phone:  (907) 443-3221                                                       
  Position Statement:  opposed fees and cost shifting                          
                                                                               
  DONNA HURDLE                                                                 
  Planned Parenthood of Alaska                                                 
  406 West Fireweed Lane                                                       
  Anchorage, AK 99503                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 272-4822                                                       
  Position Statement:  requested specification of which                        
                       sexually-transmitted diseases allow for                 
                       waivers                                                 
                                                                               
  CARMEN DIEZ CANSECO-MALLIJUDI                                                
  3150 Seawind Drive                                                           
  Anchorage, AK 99516                                                          
  Position Statement:  opposed charging lab fees, called                       
                       policy short-sighted                                    
                                                                               
  FRANK L. PAULS, M.D.                                                         
  3431 Cottonwood Street                                                       
  Anchorage, AK 99508                                                          
  Phone:  (907) 274-9930                                                       
  Position Statement:  opposed fees as likely to result in                     
                       further cuts in general fund support of                 
                       state labs                                              
                                                                               
  ROSE TANAKA, Manger                                                          
  Public Health Lab                                                            
  Division of Public Health                                                    
  Department of Health & Social Services, Anchorage                            
  P.O. Box 110610                                                              
  Juneau, AK 99811-0610                                                        
  Phone:  (907) 465-3090                                                       
  Position Statement:  representing self, opposed fees                         
                                                                               
                                                                               
  ACTION NARRATIVE                                                             
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-68, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 002                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR CYNTHIA TOOHEY called the meeting to order at 9:00                     
  a.m. and noted members and other legislators present.  She                   
  announced the calendar, namely consideration of regulations                  
  proposed by the Department of Health & Social Services to                    
  charge fees for services at state laboratories and for                       
  radiological safety testing.                                                 
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY noted that the meeting was being                                
  teleconferenced to Juneau, Fairbanks, Bethel, Nome, Delta                    
  Junction, Glennallen, Soldotna, Valdez, Cordova, Seward, and                 
  Homer.  She stated that hearings had been held on July 30                    
  regarding the proposed regulations, but concerns expressed                   
  to her and other legislators had led to the House HESS                       
  Committee hearing on the same matter.  She stated that the                   
  Division of Public Health would consider testimony from this                 
  hearing as it implemented its new regulations and outlined                   
  the history of the regulations in question.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 067                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. NAKAMURA, Director, Division of Public Health,                           
  Department of Health and Social Services, began his                          
  testimony by stating the importance of public health                         
  independent of the process of health care reform.  He                        
  explained that the state's labs are an integral part of the                  
  public health system, which is maintained by the state and                   
  federal governments.  He noted that funds were essential to                  
  providing public health services, including lab services,                    
  and when funds are not available several options exist:                      
  altering the manner of services provided, either in quality                  
  or quantity; or generating resources to maintain a level of                  
  services.  Fees are an attempt to do the latter, he said.                    
                                                                               
  Number 113                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. BRICE noted that the need for general fund monies for                   
  the state laboratory program hadn't arisen in Health &                       
  Social Services (HSS) Finance Subcommittee meetings, or if                   
  it had been brought up it wasn't addressed.  Rep. Brice                      
  inquired what the status of lab funding had been at the time                 
  the HSS Finance Subcommittee was doing its work.                             
                                                                               
  DR. NAKAMURA responded that the initial cuts to the                          
  division's budget had come in 1993, which caused the                         
  division to consider where funds could be raised to replace                  
  the lost general fund monies.  Various programs were looked                  
  at and lab services were considered a potential source for                   
  an estimated $264,000.                                                       
                                                                               
  Number 129                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KATHERINE KELLEY confirmed this amount at Dr. Nakamura's                 
  request.                                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 130                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. NAKAMURA finished by explaining that though the division                 
  did not specifically request general funds for the labs,                     
  they were at that time dealing with budgetary shortfalls                     
  that extended into FY '94.                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 135                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KATHERINE KELLEY, Chief of Public Health Laboratories                    
  for the  Division of Public Health, Department of Health and                 
  Social Services, announced that she would be using an                        
  overhead projector, prompting Rep. Brice to ask that the                     
  materials she would display be transmitted to him via                        
  facsimile.                                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 144                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY responded that the information would be sent up                 
  after the presentation.                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 145                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY began by describing the state's public health lab                 
  system:  operating labs in Anchorage, Fairbanks, and Juneau;                 
  the office of radiological health; and the chief's office.                   
  She noted that some sort of public health lab had been                       
  available since territorial days with a varying array of                     
  services provided.  She stated that in the past ten years                    
  services at the public health labs had been reduced by                       
  transferring them to other agencies or eliminating them.                     
  Transferred services include all environmental testing                       
  (except water microbiology in Juneau), the PSP program                       
  (transferred to the Department of Environmental                              
  Conservation), and the DWI program moved in 1987 (at which                   
  time drug testing by public health labs was completely                       
  eliminated).                                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 180                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY indicated that a quality assurance program had                    
  been dropped, too, and the motivation for these changes had                  
  been the budget.  The labs were funded entirely from the                     
  general fund, and the initial cuts in FY '93 led to an                       
  effort to shift federal funds to cover the labs costs.                       
  Federal funds include Medicare and Medicaid, which cannot be                 
  billed selectively; every one must be billed for a service                   
  if Medicare and Medicaid will pay for it.  This led to                       
  development of a schedule of fees that Dr. Kelley stated                     
  seemed conservative to the division.  This would have                        
  yielded an estimated $260,000 for half of FY '93.  Dr.                       
  Kelley said that in order for the labs to bill legally,                      
  regulations must specify for what services they would bill                   
  and in what exact amounts.  The review of all Health &                       
  Social Services regulations would provide an opportunity for                 
  all the divisions to evaluate their receipts and modify fees                 
  charged, but a comprehensive fee schedule is time-consuming.                 
                                                                               
  Number 219                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY continued by stating that concerned parties knew                  
  of the proposed fee increases by the time the July 30                        
  meeting was announced, and she had tried to give as much                     
  advance notice as possible.  She reflected that the public                   
  notice format does not attract much attention, operating                     
  within a certain bureaucratic framework.  She said she                       
  appreciated the fact that many persons sincerely felt they                   
  had not received adequate notice.                                            
                                                                               
  Number 236                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY displayed an overhead transparency illustrating                   
  the public notice process and a summary of the verbal                        
  comments from the July 30 meeting with written comments                      
  received through August 18.  These comments were divided                     
  into categories of concern:  cost of fees and impact on care                 
  (27 comments); epidemiological impact (17 comments); and                     
  concerns about specific fees and how they would be collected                 
  in situations of high public health concern (no number).                     
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY mentioned for Rep. Brice's benefit that the                       
  transparency she was currently discussing was in the file in                 
  his possession.                                                              
                                                                               
  Continuing with categories of concern, DR. KELLEY listed                     
  possible privatization of public health labs and efficiency                  
  of public health labs compared with the private sector;                      
  regulations and the notice process; the amount of detail in                  
  regulations and the guidance they provide; billing and                       
  payment of fees; and the decision-making process on                          
  implementation including waivers and discounts.  Fifteen                     
  comments were received on radiological fees.                                 
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY noted that there was a lot of misunderstanding                    
  about the proposed fees and that fees were calculated in                     
  accordance with a system derived from the Centers for                        
  Disease Control and the public health lab directors using a                  
  standard lab accounting system common in the private sector.                 
  The cost of lab time is the base unit for the system.                        
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY cited the proposed fee documentation,                             
  specifically the charts on pages 14-19 comparing costs of                    
  public fee schedules at private labs doing business in                       
  Alaska (based on FY '92 figures).  Dr. Kelley pointed out                    
  that she was aware that public fee schedules do not                          
  represent all prices charged for services by labs, given                     
  some contractual arrangements.  She explained how she had                    
  gone through the fee schedule and marked the fees that were                  
  higher, roughly equal, or lower than the proposed state                      
  fees, calculating that for the 68 state public health lab                    
  fees for which comparable private data existed 57% were                      
  lower, 24% were about the same, and 19% were higher than the                 
  private fees.  She listed the procedures for which the                       
  proposed state fees were higher, describing these as time-                   
  consuming and/or rare.                                                       
                                                                               
  Number 389                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY addressed the epidemiological impact of the                       
  proposed fees, noting that the major concern she was aware                   
  of was the waiver language in the regulations.  She                          
  recommended reading the regulations, most importantly the                    
  sliding fee scale section which mentions health services but                 
  not labs, because it was not the division's intent to use                    
  the sliding scale for lab services.  She explained that                      
  waivers were intended to apply to lab fees, then read how                    
  the waivers would help provide necessary public health                       
  information when an outbreak occurred, as fees for testing                   
  for it would be waived.                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 441                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked DR. KELLEY if she considered TB or HIV an                 
  ongoing epidemic.                                                            
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY responded that these diseases were ongoing                        
  epidemics but not outbreaks, which are clusters being                        
  investigated in order to find the source and bring in                        
  necessary medical services to stop the spread of a disease.                  
  She then pointed out that a waiver could be granted if the                   
  lab service was necessary to detect a sexually-transmitted                   
  or communicable disease that would pose a health risk to the                 
  general public.  She said this was an example of a long-                     
  term, ongoing effort to control, say, HIV.                                   
                                                                               
  Number 462                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. BRICE asked DR. KELLEY if removal of the term                           
  "sexually-transmitted" meant such diseases would be covered                  
  by the term "communicable."                                                  
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY responded in the affirmative.                                     
                                                                               
  Number 470                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY noted that REP. BETTYE DAVIS joined the                         
  meeting.                                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 474                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY spoke of the third justification for waiving a                    
  fee, which states that the inability to pay will not result                  
  in denial of services.  She noted that this provision was                    
  not only regulatory but present in the enabling statute.                     
  She cited page 8, mentioning free screening and pre- and                     
  post-test counseling as services that must be offered free                   
  of charge in the interest of public health, which she                        
  interpreted as meaning HIV testing would be offered for                      
  free.  She said that the Department of Law had instructed                    
  the writers of the fee schedule that unless a service has a                  
  fee associated with it, no fee could be charged under any                    
  circumstances; HIV and TB are listed in the schedule to                      
  allow for the possibility of charging for testing in a                       
  specific situation, such as a contract research project.                     
                                                                               
  Number 530                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY reiterated that she wanted to know if the labs                  
  would charge for TB and sexually transmitted diseases.                       
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY responded that no fees would be charged when the                  
  tests were in the interest of public health.                                 
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked how they defined the interest of public                   
  health.                                                                      
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY stated that that was "the tough one."  With TB,                   
  she said, the labs would take direction from the Section of                  
  Epidemiology.                                                                
                                                                               
  Number 550                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. BRICE mentioned that many concerns were based on the                    
  definition of public health, especially if said definition                   
  depended on funding levels, and a drop in funding levels                     
  could make some tests less important to the public health                    
  than they should be.  He asserted his desire for a stronger,                 
  clearer definition of public health in order to allow for                    
  better guidelines.                                                           
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY responded that in her thirty-year career in                       
  public health she had experienced constant grappling with                    
  the definition of public health and she didn't think she                     
  could answer the question once and for all, but the Alaskan                  
  definition was the relevant one and the public health                        
  meeting in Fairbanks in September would be an excellent                      
  forum to define public health.                                               
                                                                               
  Number 590                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. SITTON said he agreed with Rep. Brice that the state                    
  underfunds public health, and asked Dr. Kelley why so few                    
  federal funds were available for state labs.                                 
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY responded that traditionally public health labs                   
  had not received direct funding from the federal government,                 
  even from the mother agency, the Centers for Disease                         
  Control.  Dr. Kelley said that the majority of federal funds                 
  were grants to the program element housed in the Section of                  
  Epidemiology, which was generous in assisting public health                  
  labs with the federal funds available to them.  She noted                    
  that while labs had not been well-funded federally, she had                  
  written a grant application for equipment replacement to                     
  reduce the diagnosis time for TB, and the labs had received                  
  $38,000.  Dr. Kelley stated that she expected no federal                     
  funding in the coming year.                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 660                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. SITTON commented that without dealing with the                          
  specifics of the fee schedule, nothing is more cost-                         
  effective than prevention, and any fee interfering with                      
  prevention defeated the main purpose.  He stressed the                       
  imperative of adequately funding public health, and                          
  expressed his concern with the Division of Public Health's                   
  quarter-million dollar budget cuts every year.                               
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY mentioned that the division had not had its                     
  funding reduced at least since 1988 and these reductions had                 
  not originated in the legislature.                                           
                                                                               
  Number 683                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. SITTON responded that he had thought he had seen a                      
  $254,000 operations reduction in the last year.                              
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY said that it must have been an inter-agency                     
  reallocation, as the legislature had not cut it.  She then                   
  asked DR. KELLEY to finish up her testimony.                                 
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-68, SIDE B                                                           
  Number 028                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY spoke about the privatization concerns raised at                  
  the July 30 meeting, and tests that would be shifted to the                  
  private sector.  She asserted that these concerns were                       
  common to every one involved in public health who want just                  
  to survive and not to compete.  She stated that she hoped                    
  the waiver system was comprehensible, and if there were                      
  questions, she would answer them if possible.                                
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY mentioned concerns about the efficiency of the                    
  public health labs, not for quality, but for fiscal                          
  efficiency, given bureaucratic constraints.  She accepted                    
  that the state health labs were not fiscally efficient                       
  compared with those in the private sector, and she had so                    
  stated at the July 30 meeting.                                               
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY mentioned that billing would be direct to a                       
  third-party payer if one existed, and the labs would collect                 
  a minimum of information above that currently collected from                 
  providers; three or four simple questions would be asked                     
  regarding a patient's insurance status, and the policy                       
  number if insured.  She said providers would decide if                       
  patients needed to use the waiver option due to an inability                 
  to pay.                                                                      
                                                                               
  Number 070                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY clarified her earlier comment on the budget's                   
  not having been reduced, stating that the lab budget had not                 
  been reduced.  She continued, saying that a major concern                    
  she had heard was whether or not one would have to lie in                    
  order to get a test fee waived.                                              
                                                                               
  Number 084                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHARLES TEDFORD, Radiological Health Specialist, Division of                 
  Public Health, Department of Health and Social Services,                     
  addressed three questions about the radiologic health                        
  program.  Mr. Tedford noted that there were 1265 x-ray tubes                 
  in the state at many different medical offices, a majority                   
  being dental.  He stated that there were 29 or 30                            
  mammography units, spread out individually except for                        
  concentrations of three in Anchorage and Juneau.  Mr.                        
  Tedford noted that proposed fee increases were from $20 to                   
  $50 on dental tubes; from $30 to $80 for medical units; and                  
  $1500 for mammography inspections.                                           
                                                                               
  MR. TEDFORD noted three issues arising when considering                      
  fees:  cost by number of inspections and related expenses;                   
  total departmental expenses; and comparison with other                       
  states (asserting that Alaska was more expensive than other                  
  states due to travel and other factors).  He said that                       
  presently the program had $140,000 and one person, and that                  
  it ought to have $250,000 and three persons.  He stated that                 
  the fees covered 25-50% of actual costs excluding                            
  mammography; the federal contribution to the mammography                     
  figure was probably $1200, which Alaskans probably would not                 
  pay.  He said the mammography program would be transferred                   
  to the Food & Drug Administration on October 1, 1994, though                 
  it may still be administered by the state's radiological                     
  health officer.  He mentioned the operator licensing                         
  inspector who accompanied him on inspections as an example                   
  of additional expenses to mammography.                                       
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked MR. TEDFORD if he considered equipment                    
  manufacturer's contract tests valid.                                         
                                                                               
  MR. TEDFORD noted that that question had been raised at the                  
  July 30 hearing, and a radiologist had stated that he was                    
  inspected four times a year; this duplication comes from                     
  different sources requiring inspection.                                      
                                                                               
  Number 174                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. TEDFORD mentioned a recent study requested by Governor                   
  Hickel on radiological threats in response to events at Fort                 
  Greely and Point Hope, citing the top recommendation:  the                   
  state ought to revise and implement the existing x-ray unit                  
  inspection program to ensure that x-ray units are inspected                  
  and that the frequency inspections recommended protects                      
  public health; the greatest exposure for most Alaskans to                    
  radiation comes from diagnostic x-rays used in medical and                   
  dental facilities; inspection of x-ray machines and                          
  correction of deficiencies is the most effective way to                      
  minimize unnecessary exposure; and inspections in Alaska are                 
  far behind schedule.                                                         
                                                                               
  Number 198                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. TEDFORD noted the question of why mammography fees were                  
  so much higher than for other machines, answering that they                  
  required much longer inspections due to Medicare funding                     
  requirements.  He noted the question of why the radiological                 
  inspector was situated in Juneau when most units requiring                   
  inspection were elsewhere, and answered that most programs                   
  of this sort were located in state capitals and relocating                   
  the inspector would have only a very small effect on costs.                  
  He mentioned the issues of how often inspections were                        
  required and how frequently they occurred; if other                          
  qualified individuals could perform inspections and submit                   
  reports; if inspections could be conducted by mail; and what                 
  qualifications an inspector needed.                                          
                                                                               
  Number 248                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY thanked MR. TEDFORD and asked for the SEWARD                    
  TELECONFERENCE SITE to present testimony.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 256                                                                   
                                                                               
  MARGARET ERICKSON, Head of the Radiology Department at                       
  Seward General Hospital, stated that the hospital's greatest                 
  concern was the increased cost of inspection, largely                        
  because of travel costs.  She endorsed the idea of moving                    
  the radiological inspector's office to Anchorage for cost                    
  savings before adoption of the $1500 fee.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 274                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY thanked Ms. Erickson for her testimony and                      
  noted for the record the arrival of Rep. Jim Nordlund.  She                  
  then asked for the DELTA JUNCTION TELECONFERENCE SITE to                     
  present testimony.                                                           
                                                                               
  Number 282                                                                   
                                                                               
  TONI LEE, Laboratory Supervisor, Family Medical Center,                      
  commented that the proposed lab fees would be a problem in                   
  her area due to an influx of low-income persons and                          
  increased dependence on state labs.  She mentioned                           
  difficulty in getting patients to submit insurance                           
  information or documentation of inability to pay, and state                  
  labs' history of intervention in epidemics before they                       
  start.  Ms. Lee expressed her belief that it is harder to                    
  get someone to pay for a procedure that does not affect him                  
  or her directly.                                                             
                                                                               
  Number 299                                                                   
                                                                               
  SHELIA NORDALE, Central Peninsula General Hospital,                          
  Soldotna, stated that charging fees for services could                       
  restrict accessibility to health care by the poor and if                     
  persons avoided testing for sexually transmitted diseases or                 
  TB, waiting until their condition became critical, greater                   
  expense would result than that incurred by screening and                     
  early treatment.  She said that if state labs began                          
  charging, the hospital would likely start sending its tests                  
  to a reference lab, which would delay collection of data for                 
  epidemiological purposes.  Ms. Nordale noted that if state                   
  labs charged a retail price, it might increase health care                   
  costs for consumers.                                                         
                                                                               
  Number 324                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY thanked MS. NORDALE for her testimony and asked                 
  for the next witness.                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 327                                                                   
                                                                               
  JOAN BENNET SCHRADER, Coalition of Labor Union Women, Mount                  
  Redoubt Chapter, Kenai, spoke of the taxpayers' having paid                  
  for a modern lab that was badly needed and her group's                       
  concern over the status of public health in the state.  Ms.                  
  Schrader asked for a series of conveniently timed public                     
  meetings to discuss this issue and mentioned that labs on                    
  the Kenai Peninsula had to choose between testing for HIV                    
  and testing for TB.  Ms. Schrader asked the legislature to                   
  fund clinics at a level that would eliminate fees, and                       
  characterized this as a responsibility.                                      
                                                                               
  Number 362                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY pointed out to Ms. Schrader that the statute                    
  allowing for regulations charging fees dated from 1986,                      
  though the fees themselves were more recent.                                 
                                                                               
  The Chair then recognized REP. BRICE.                                        
                                                                               
  Number 370                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. SCHRADER interrupted, claiming that her group recognized                 
  the point made by Chair Toohey, but by accepting                             
  responsibility as taxpayers and voters, they knew that the                   
  law had sometimes to be amended or changed.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 375                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. BRICE asked for Ms. Schrader's address.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 380                                                                   
                                                                               
  SEN. LITTLE said she was appalled to hear Mr. Tedford say                    
  that some radiological units had not been inspected in ten                   
  years, and asked him to verify that she had heard him                        
  correctly.  She inquired as to the type of units having gone                 
  uninspected.                                                                 
                                                                               
  MR. TEDFORD stated that he would have to check records to                    
  provide the exact units, but they were of all types, in                      
  isolated areas.  He said he would provide the information                    
  after checking the record, though he remembered a number in                  
  the seven-year category.  Mr. Tedford asserted the need for                  
  more staff to conduct inspections.                                           
                                                                               
  Number 401                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY stated that the radiological testing program was                  
  a one person office, and x-ray inspections were but a part                   
  of his job, which included providing expert advice to the                    
  Governor and others on radiation.  She added that it had                     
  taken over two years after the last radiological physicist                   
  retired to recruit a replacement.                                            
                                                                               
  REP. NICHOLIA stated that she thought it would be wise to                    
  move the radiological testing person to Anchorage to improve                 
  access to rural areas.                                                       
                                                                               
  Number 431                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked SEN. LITTLE if she had further                            
  commentary.                                                                  
                                                                               
  SEN. LITTLE responded that she was certain this was an area                  
  requiring change, better performance, and heightened                         
  efficiency in addressing public health needs.  She stated                    
  she was unconvinced that higher fees were the answer, but                    
  ensuring the inspection of radiological equipment more                       
  frequently than once a decade was necessary.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 444                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked the FAIRBANKS TELECONFERENCE SITE to                      
  present testimony, suggesting that REP. SITTON and REP.                      
  BRICE speak.                                                                 
                                                                               
  REP. BRICE mentioned that Rep. Sitton had intended to speak                  
  but he had to leave.  Rep. Brice stated he would let persons                 
  who had come to testify present their testimonies.                           
                                                                               
  Number 456                                                                   
                                                                               
  TERRY SCHMIDT, Lab Supervisor, State Health Laboratory,                      
  Division of Public Health, Department of Health and Social                   
  Services, spoke as an individual.  He referred to page 45 of                 
  the proposal where lab services were allocated $2.2 million                  
  for FY '92.  He subtracted radon monitoring and radiological                 
  testing costs to arrive at a figure of $2.1 million for lab                  
  services.                                                                    
                                                                               
  MR. SCHMIDT mentioned the figures used to determine the                      
  work-time unit from page 77, stating that horizontal                         
  addition of those numbers yielded a figure of almost $3.5                    
  million, indicating that the total cost used to calculate                    
  fees exceeded the actual appropriation by $1.4 million.  Mr.                 
  Schmidt said the cost of tests and the resultant proposed                    
  fees were inflated by 63%.  He questioned the work-time unit                 
  for individual tests, citing his prior day's lab experience                  
  setting 170 hepatitis-b tests, which he processed the                        
  following morning.  Mr. Schmidt noted that the proposed fee                  
  was based on a lab work-time of ten minutes for a single                     
  hepatitis-b test, and the official time he calculated of                     
  1700 minutes (just over 23 hours) was much greater than the                  
  two and a half hours it actually had taken him.                              
                                                                               
  MR. SCHMIDT hypothesized that the figures were determined                    
  based on small numbers of tests being done, though large                     
  batches were common.  He stated his belief in the efficiency                 
  of the labs, but it was unreasonable to expect tests to be                   
  sent to the labs if overcharging occurred.  He noted that                    
  the cost estimates accounted for having to set up a billing                  
  system that would require four new positions, leasing a                      
  computer at a cost of $300,000, and paying for office space.                 
                                                                               
                                                                               
  Number 527                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. SCHMIDT emphasized that revenues from fees would                         
  probably not exceed the costs of implementing the fee                        
  schedule.  He stated that the labs' approximate budget                       
  request for FY '94 was $2.9 million, which he divided by the                 
  state's population to arrive at a cost per person of $5.30,                  
  or just over $21 for a family of four.  Mr. Schmidt stated                   
  his belief that the labs provided a level of service to each                 
  Alaskan.                                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 541                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked for persons present at the meeting in                     
  ANCHORAGE to testify next.                                                   
                                                                               
  Number 562                                                                   
                                                                               
  JENNIFER GARCIA, Anchorage, stated that she had testified at                 
  the July 30 hearing on the proposed regulations and many of                  
  her concerns had since been addressed.  She said she felt                    
  privatization was coming to the state lab system and                         
  wondered whether the public sector could bid for components                  
  of the work, such as insurance billing.  Ms. Garcia stated                   
  that she thought billing would involve fourth and fifth                      
  parties after the third party, that it would be expensive,                   
  and that it was not a task to which lab technicians were                     
  accustomed.                                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 600                                                                   
                                                                               
  HEATHER FLYNN, Executive Director of Abused Women's Aid in                   
  Crisis (AWAIC), Anchorage, told how the shelter received                     
  weekly services via a federal grant and the Neighborhood                     
  Health Center.  She said a registered nurse visited weekly                   
  to tend to cuts and bruises, but women coming to the shelter                 
  were often unable to get basic health services.  Ms. Flynn                   
  said the Neighborhood Health Center provided blood analysis,                 
  urological analysis, gynecological tests, and other services                 
  to which women at the shelter often haven't had access in a                  
  long time, intervening at a much better point than if the                    
  conditions were allowed to go untreated.  She said a lot of                  
  children were helped by the shelter through such procedures                  
  as well baby checks, immunizations, and other treatment of                   
  common ailments.  She praised the Neighborhood Health                        
  Center's contributions to the shelter's operations,                          
  mentioning her awareness that the Center used state labs for                 
  all the shelter's tests.  Ms. Flynn expressed concern that                   
  paperwork generated by the proposed regulations would take                   
  funds from actual lab work, and pointed out that persons                     
  leaving her shelter continued to rely on the Neighborhood                    
  Health Center or the Municipal Health Department.                            
                                                                               
  Number 669                                                                   
                                                                               
  JEAN WOLF, Municipal Department of Health & Human Services                   
  Community Health Services Division, Anchorage, stated that                   
  she had testified at the July 30 hearing and she felt more                   
  comfortable after hearing Dr. Kelley's remarks.  Ms. Wolf                    
  expressed lingering concern for some clients unable to pay                   
  for services.  Her first concern was perception, based on                    
  her experience with federal parental notification rules,                     
  that publicity could deter persons from coming in for tests                  
  merely because they would think they would have to pay until                 
  the were seriously ill.  Ms. Wolf stated that good                           
  information needed to go out to the public regarding fees,                   
  and she would like an agreement that if the fee system                       
  turned out not to work, the issue could be revisited in                      
  order to make the system work better.                                        
                                                                               
  Number 721                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY clarified that statute signs bearing the                        
  message that one would not have to pay if one could not                      
  afford it would be posted at all lab sites.  She said she                    
  felt this was a very important message.                                      
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-69, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 001                                                                   
                                                                               
  MS. WOLF noted that having signs up at clinics would make no                 
  difference if persons failed to come to those locations.                     
  She stated that there had been a reduction in public health                  
  service funding at the municipal level, with more tasks                      
  being done by fewer persons.                                                 
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY recognized JAN WELLS.                                           
                                                                               
  Number 022                                                                   
                                                                               
  JAN WELLS, TB Control Community Health Nurse Supervisor for                  
  the Municipal Department of Health & Human Services,                         
  Anchorage, said she was reassured by Dr. Nakamura and Dr.                    
  Kelley's statements that necessary public health work could                  
  be done without charging for lab tests.  She said she was                    
  still concerned at hearing of cost shifting at the state                     
  Department of Health & Social Services as this had happened                  
  with Medicaid and Medicare.  Ms. Wells stated that in                        
  seeking payment for services that had been publicly funded,                  
  the focus of those services might shift due to staffing                      
  constraints.  She praised the quality of state labs and                      
  expressed her hope that the system, of which all were proud,                 
  would be maintained in spite of fees.                                        
                                                                               
  Number 045                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY called WILLIAM GALLANGER to testify.                            
                                                                               
  WILLIAM GALLANGER, Anchorage, stated that he worked in lab                   
  services but was representing himself at the hearing, though                 
  he felt he represented many lab workers and their concerns.                  
  He said based on his handling of TB work, he would like to                   
  maintain the quality of lab services, and the fee schedule                   
  would limit the availability of health care.  He said that                   
  in Alaska private labs often hadn't the resources to provide                 
  testing for low income persons.  Mr. Gallanger told a story                  
  about an immigrant to the U.S.A. who was in Alaska but three                 
  days, displayed TB symptoms, and came into contact with                      
  approximately 200 persons while staying at the Brother                       
  Francis Shelter.  He made the point that if all 200 persons                  
  had needed to be tested, it would have stressed the clinic,                  
  lab, and hospital involved to the point of sending specimens                 
  to an Outside reference lab.  Mr. Gallanger expressed hope                   
  that given the speed and efficiency of state labs, the                       
  legislature would prioritize which tests would remain                        
  available for no fee in order to protect rural areas likely                  
  to be impacted harder than Anchorage.                                        
                                                                               
  Number 097                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked Dr. Kelley if she would like to address                   
  Mr. Gallanger's concerns.                                                    
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY stated that the example situation would come                      
  under the outbreak or emergency category, and that skin                      
  tests would be done prior to lab tests.                                      
                                                                               
  Number 109                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY called for the PETERSBURG TELECONFERENCE SITE                   
  to present testimony.                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 110                                                                   
                                                                               
  SALLY GUINEY, Lab Director and Radiologist, Petersburg                       
  General Hospital, stated that $1500 was too high a fee for                   
  mammography, noting that a Seattle physicist was performing                  
  annual inspections for them for Medicare certification at a                  
  cost of $2500.  She said that in addition to this, they paid                 
  for Medicare and state inspections of other radiological                     
  equipment.  Ms. Guiney asked why mammography and general                     
  tube inspections couldn't be combined to reduce costs,                       
  perhaps inspecting all tubes in a community on one visit.                    
  Ms. Guiney stated that the hospital often used the Juneau                    
  state lab for confirmation of work, not for primary testing.                 
  She then asked what the fees would be for specimens sent for                 
  identification, pointing out a discrepancy between two                       
  different figures for a parasitology test.                                   
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY said the fee would be $19.75 for parasitology,                    
  and confirmation tests would be charged back.                                
                                                                               
  Number 159                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked SUSAN KERNES at the HOMER TELECONFERENCE                  
  SITE to testify.                                                             
                                                                               
  SUSAN KERNES, President, Kachemak Bay Family Planning Clinic                 
  Board of Directors, identified herself as underinsured, and                  
  stated that public health was a part of government's duty to                 
  maintain public safety.  She said the public health system                   
  was in place to monitor and react to general public well-                    
  being, a mission that would be undermined by fees that could                 
  force family planning clinics to shut.  Ms. Kernes explained                 
  that the clinic received many reproductive health services                   
  at low cost or free from state labs and charged low fees to                  
  clients.  She commented on a study by a New York consultant                  
  assessing the sometimes unsafe, crumbling lab                                
  infrastructure, which recommended centralization as the way                  
  to go.  She noted that the study suggested closing the three                 
  main labs due to inadequate physical plant.  She recommended                 
  creating a new state of the art facility to serve the entire                 
  state, as well as possibly in terms of accuracy, speed and                   
  efficiency.                                                                  
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY recessed the meeting for five minutes.                          
                                                                               
  Number 205                                                                   
                                                                               
  KIM SMITH, Kachemak Bay Family Planning Clinic, testified                    
  from Homer that cervical cancer and genital warts were                       
  considered public health issues.  She said 27 pap smears had                 
  been done at four clinics in July and August and the average                 
  client's income was $918.15 per month.  She asserted the                     
  importance of these critical procedures to women and her                     
  desire to see them remain available.  Ms. Smith proposed, in                 
  reference to HIV, that the health of an entire community                     
  often depended on the health status of its least advantaged                  
  member, indicating that health care must be obtainable.                      
                                                                               
  Number 227                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY recognized DAN FIEBELKORN in Homer.                             
                                                                               
  DAN FIEBELKORN identified himself as Lab Director at South                   
  Peninsula Hospital, and said he had been in health care                      
  service in Alaskan labs for twenty years and he truly                        
  appreciated state labs.  He stated the need to keep billing                  
  in the hospital, which would not happen in cases of                          
  inability to pay, resulting in violation of HIV test                         
  confidentiality as information was released.  He indicated                   
  that borderline cases would probably go to reference labs,                   
  using staff time and funds, leading towards privatization                    
  which would have a greater negative impact rurally.                          
                                                                               
  Number 250                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked DR. KELLEY to respond.                                    
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY stated that there was no plan to charge for HIV                   
  testing in the normal course of events, making fears of                      
  billing information leaking into the insurance system                        
  unfounded.  She said she shared the reference lab concern,                   
  anticipating the loss of some data.  She cited studies from                  
  other states where fees had been implemented showing a                       
  return to 80-90% of the pre-fee workload after a year with                   
  fees.                                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 270                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked if anyone in ANCHORAGE wishing to testify                 
  had a time constraint.                                                       
                                                                               
  MR. FIEBELKORN asked Dr. Kelley how cases where a patient                    
  was able to pay for an HIV test would be handled, as no                      
  specific provision exempted such persons from billing.                       
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY answered that HIV testing was listed only to                      
  allow for the possibility of billing at some future point,                   
  which would be impossible were it not listed.  She said                      
  future information would address the matter.                                 
                                                                               
  Number 295                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY called witnesses to the table, then recognized                  
  MARY JEFFERSON and DONALD NOVOTNEY at the JUNEAU                             
  TELECONFERENCE SITE.                                                         
                                                                               
  MARY JEFFERSON said she was Lab Manager at Bartlett Memorial                 
  Hospital and listed four concerns:  that fees not be charged                 
  for epidemiological activity, such as stereotyping organisms                 
  for CDC; that fees not be charged for TB monitoring, which                   
  was proposed excepting that funding developments could alter                 
  this; that Bartlett would shop for the cheapest and quickest                 
  lab, reducing the state's access to information; and that                    
  billing would be hard in labs without computers.  Ms.                        
  Jefferson noted that lab workers in Alaska are uncommon, and                 
  that adding billing to their appointed duties would increase                 
  stress on the profession.                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 350                                                                   
                                                                               
  DONALD NOVOTNEY said he was Infection Control Practitioner                   
  at Bartlett Memorial Hospital, and explained that his job                    
  was to protect employees.  He cited Occupational Safety &                    
  Health Administration requirements for occupational exposure                 
  control with HIV and hepatitis-b, noting that although HIV                   
  tests were to remain free, there might be charges for                        
  hepatitis tests.  He mentioned that state labs had a ten-day                 
  return time, and price differentials would necessitate                       
  shopping.  Mr. Novotney noted that he would prefer to keep                   
  the money in Alaska if speed and cost were comparable.  He                   
  said that he would like to see duplication of services                       
  eliminated.                                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 389                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY thanked Mr. Novotney for his testimony and                      
  asked TONY BELL to speak.                                                    
                                                                               
  TONY BELL said he was a Nurse Practitioner who had been at                   
  an STD Clinic for thirteen years.  He listed his concerns:                   
  that the definition of public health was related to waiver                   
  of fees for certain procedures based on the availability of                  
  funds; that confidentiality be maintained; that word of fees                 
  would deter persons from testing despite public notice of                    
  the waiver system; that collection of data not be impaired;                  
  and that more paperwork would be detrimental to clinical                     
  efficacy.                                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 425                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY pointed out that by law clinics must notify the                 
  Division of Public Health of suspected TB or sexually                        
  transmitted disease infection.                                               
                                                                               
  MR. BELL responded that identification had to be by number                   
  and not by name.                                                             
                                                                               
  DR. NAKAMURA noted that the regulations allowed for                          
  providers to exercise judgment in order to maintain good                     
  public health practices.                                                     
                                                                               
  Number 447                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY called DR. HAROLD JOHNSON to speak.                             
                                                                               
  HAROLD JOHNSON said he was Family Physician and Medical                      
  Director of the Anchorage Neighborhood Health Center, and                    
  that information he had heard at the day's hearing allayed                   
  his fears, which were the viability of state labs facing                     
  competition with lower fees (his annual fees at proposed                     
  state levels would be $120,000 versus $90,000 with a private                 
  contractor), and the loss of epidemiological information as                  
  free testing ended for many persons and procedures.                          
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked DR. KELLEY to address these issues.                       
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY stated they would be dealt with in the final                      
  recommendations to the Commissioner of Health & Social                       
  Services.                                                                    
  DR. NAKAMURA added that most decisions would remain in the                   
  hands of providers and that the division did not want to                     
  have to decide.                                                              
                                                                               
  Number 525                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. JOHNSON asked if a provider would decide finally if a                    
  person could pay.                                                            
                                                                               
  DR. KELLEY told him he was correct.                                          
                                                                               
  Number 553                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY called DR. GEORGE HANSEN from the Alaska Dental                 
  Society, who expressed his and the Society's opposition to                   
  any increase in fees for inspection of dental x-ray                          
  machines.  He noted his lack of expertise in radiology, but                  
  also his twenty-five years using dental x-ray equipment.  He                 
  said dentists agreed to testing of machines initially to                     
  comply with federal law and offer the best possible service                  
  to patients, and the fee of $20 had been thought reasonable                  
  given the nature of the machines and their use.                              
                                                                               
  Number 570                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. HANSEN explained dentists' experiences with inspectors,                  
  and voiced his belief that inspections probably ought to be                  
  regularly timed and less labor-intensive.  He stated that                    
  dental x-rays were being considered inaccurately with                        
  medical devices, and the proposed fee increase was unwise as                 
  it would be paid by patients.                                                
                                                                               
  Number 639                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY thanked DR. HANSEN for his testimony and noted                  
  that she had a letter from a DR. HIBSCHER that she would                     
  like to have included in the record.                                         
                                                                               
  The Chair then called for KAY LAHDEMPERE.                                    
                                                                               
  KAY LAHDEMPERE, Public Health Nurse Manager, Municipal                       
  Family Planning Clinic, said she had been with the clinic                    
  since 1966.  Ms. Lahdempere said she had worked extensively                  
  with state labs, and that tests ought to continue to go to                   
  state labs.  She thanked Drs. Nakamura and Kelley for their                  
  sensitivity on the issue, noting her lab was charged with                    
  serving low-income and teen-aged patients.  She noted three                  
  items:  use of Outside labs, consistency of epidemiological                  
  reporting, and clients' hardships.                                           
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked Ms. Lahdempere to limit her testimony to                  
  the allotted time.                                                           
                                                                               
  MS. LAHDEMPERE noted problems in using Outside labs, and the                 
  chlamydia rate among persons aged fifteen years and younger                  
  was 25%, necessitating reasonable fees.                                      
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-69, SIDE B                                                           
  Number 011                                                                   
                                                                               
  PATRICIA HONG, President, Alaska Nurses Association,                         
  reminded the committee that nurses nationally supported                      
  prevention and health promotion programs over treatment.                     
  She noted that health promotion and disease prevention                       
  required surveillance which could not occur if fees were                     
  prohibitive.  She stated that she didn't want to see a shift                 
  to illness care only, but hoped Alaska's focus on prevention                 
  would persist.                                                               
                                                                               
  Number 022                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY recognized REP. BRICE, and asked the FAIRBANKS                  
  TELECONFERENCE SITE to testify.                                              
                                                                               
  REP. BRICE introduced DR. MELINDA EVANS of the Center For                    
  Health & Counseling at the University of Alaska Fairbanks.                   
                                                                               
  DR. EVANS described the Center's duty to provide primary                     
  care and counseling to students who did not budget, and thus                 
  could not pay for, health care.  Dr. Evans said students                     
  would not be able to pay for tests, and that in spite of the                 
  testimony she had heard, she feared the fees would impair                    
  her ability to track illnesses on campus.  She proposed that                 
  the fees could end up costing the state more if an outbreak                  
  resulted, and she asserted that data collection on illnesses                 
  was essential to provision of public health.  She said that                  
  private physicians and clinics did not always report data to                 
  the state.                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. EVANS stated that current practice was not to bill                       
  Medicaid, that no system was in place to determine waiver                    
  eligibility, and that increased paperwork would result.  She                 
  pointed out a flaw in the revenue estimates for the proposed                 
  fees - that reduced demand would result from increased                       
  prices, yielding less total revenue.  She defined public                     
  health as an investment in the population, and pointed to                    
  erosion of support for this investment through reduced                       
  services.  She also said she was unsure if the Center would                  
  be considered a private or public provider.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 065                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked ELMER LINDSTROM, Special Assistant to the                 
  Commissioner of Health & Social Services, to speak briefly.                  
                                                                               
  Number 068                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. LINDSTROM described the department's budgeting and the                   
  effect formula funding of some programs and of mental health                 
  trust income account funding had on other agencies in the                    
  department.  He said the Division of Public Health's budget                  
  relied on two strategies to make up for lost general funds:                  
  seeking federal grants, and Medicaid refinancing (also known                 
  as cost shifting).  The use of the latter strategy lead to                   
  confusion over whether or not reductions had occurred.  Mr.                  
  Lindstrom noted that the aforementioned consultant's report                  
  on lab consolidation was very important and needed to be                     
  considered at Dr. Nakamura's upcoming public health                          
  conference.                                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 123                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. NAKAMURA noted that the conference was legislative, not                  
  his, and that Rep. Sitton had taken the lead on getting the                  
  conference together.                                                         
                                                                               
  Number 130                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NORDLUND stated fees were dubious public policy, and as                 
  the fees had resulted from prior legislative action, it was                  
  the legislature's job to appropriate supplemental monies.                    
  CHAIR TOOHEY noted for the record that SEN. DONLEY arrived                   
  at the meeting.  She then called for SHARLANE DONALSON at                    
  the GLENALLEN TELECONFERENCE SITE to testify.                                
                                                                               
  Number 145                                                                   
                                                                               
  SHARLANE DONALSON identified herself as Lab Supervisor at                    
  Crossroads Medical Center, complimented state labs, and                      
  noted that the epidemic policy needed work in order to                       
  determine when an epidemic started and whether or not                        
  surveillance testing was necessary.  She questioned at what                  
  point waivers for testing would apply to all epidemic                        
  victims.  She said the fee schedule was flawed in that it                    
  assumed all cultures would be positive and would require                     
  full work-ups, when in reality many were negative.  Ms.                      
  Donalson said she had a computer at her facility, but she                    
  disagreed that a few simple questions would provide enough                   
  insurance information due to the complexity of third-party                   
  billing and insurers' demands for diagnostic codes.                          
                                                                               
  Number 207                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked DON RITTER and SUZANNE OLSON to testify.                  
                                                                               
  SUZANNE OLSON said she was Lab Supervisor at the Health                      
  Center at UAF, and when she had heard of impending fee                       
  increases, she had not been alarmed and expected the                         
  increases to be minimal.  She stated that the proposed fees                  
  were surprisingly high and that she would probably get lab                   
  service from other labs at a more reasonable cost, though                    
  this was not her desire.  Ms. Olson expressed her wish that                  
  careful attention be paid to lab workers' concerns, and that                 
  the erroneous method of calculating fees be addressed.                       
                                                                               
  Number 234                                                                   
                                                                               
  DON RITTER said he was speaking as a private citizen, and                    
  that the state had a moral and ethical obligation to provide                 
  for public health, and fees would ultimately jeopardize the                  
  public health infrastructure.                                                
                                                                               
  Number 252                                                                   
                                                                               
  REP. NICHOLIA mentioned significant opposition in District                   
  36 to increased lab fees, and said there had been a                          
  hepatitis epidemic, and mentioned other dangerous diseases.                  
                                                                               
  Number 273                                                                   
                                                                               
  VICKI MARIE COLACICCO, Director of Public Health Nursing at                  
  Norton Sound Hospital, commented on her need to establish a                  
  billing position in order to recoup lost general fund monies                 
  from Medicaid, which would require the loss of a nursing                     
  position.  She noted the difficulty of distinguishing                        
  between the inability and the unwillingness to pay.  She                     
  stated that TB and hepatitis were endemic in her region and                  
  the need for surveillance made deciding whether or not to                    
  waive fees difficult.  Ms. Colacicco questioned the language                 
  allowing fees to be raised or changed at the discretion of                   
  the commissioner.                                                            
                                                                               
  Number 317                                                                   
                                                                               
  DONNA HURDLE, Executive Director of Planned Parenthood, said                 
  all costs for non-profit providers were significant, meaning                 
  use of private labs would occur if necessary.  She noted her                 
  need for a list stating exactly which sexually-transmitted                   
  diseases allowed for waivers.  Ms. Hurdle stated that every                  
  one had a different means of determining ability to pay, and                 
  even in low-income groups there was a great variety of                       
  circumstances.                                                               
                                                                               
  Number 345                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY stated that each provider's definition of                       
  ability to pay was the deciding one.                                         
                                                                               
  Number 352                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked if anyone on the teleconference network                   
  wanted to testify.  There was no response.                                   
                                                                               
  Number 366                                                                   
                                                                               
  CARMEN DIEZ CANSECO-MALLIJUDI said that as a health educator                 
  she viewed collection of data as essential to health                         
  promotion, disease prevention, and cost containment.  She                    
  mentioned Alaska's problem with cervical cancer in Natives,                  
  and that cutting costs by raising fees was short-sighted.                    
                                                                               
  Number 385                                                                   
                                                                               
  DR. FRANK PAULS stated that he had expressed his views in                    
  writing to the commissioner.  He then told the committee how                 
  he had come to Alaska in 1938 to establish the first                         
  territorial lab in Juneau and had retired as chief of the                    
  Section of Labs in 1979.  He said that the hearing showed                    
  concern, and that the idea of charging fees could lead to                    
  the legislature's viewing state labs as a source of revenue,                 
  with fees' being raised to a point of self-sufficiency.  He                  
  stated that this development would result in the loss of a                   
  public service.                                                              
                                                                               
  Number 445                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY asked for a last time if anyone else wanted to                  
  testify.                                                                     
                                                                               
  ROSE TANAKA, Manager of the Public Health Lab in Anchorage,                  
  representing herself, recognized the need to look at other                   
  funding alternatives than fees, including consolidating labs                 
  and flat fees for services.                                                  
                                                                               
  Number 468                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR TOOHEY announced that public testimony was closed and                  
  indicated for the record that four minutes remained of                       
  meeting time.  She thanked the department and the interested                 
  public.  She welcomed written testimony and adjourned the                    
  meeting.                                                                     

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